Is There Any Point To Being A "Snitch" In The Torrent World?

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Vaalbeast

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Honestly I tend to just mind my own business. The way I see it, if I was able to find blatant evidence of someone trading & I don't even have all of the tools available that tracker staff do, it should be twice as obvious to them who the bad seeds are. Snitches shouldn't even be necessary. Sure some can slip through the cracks but they'll expose themselves eventually. They always do in some shape or form.
Pretty much this. Staff to staff about such matters is understandable and helpful for communities. But for normal users, attempting to be a snitch seems laughable. Do they set up a conspiracy whiteboard in their room? Are they trying to get back at someone who angered them in the forums? I get my pirated content and move on. If the trader/seller was dumb enough to be recognized between different sites, I shouldn't even need to take action and risk my account.
 

Cthulhu

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That's a real thing, oddly, very few that have taken the offer
That is because snitches are universally hated (I am not talking just about trackers). Once someone is outed as a snitch he/she will get shunned.



"Today you snitch to tracker staff, tomorrow you will be snitching to copyright holders"
 

Maelstrom

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I think the main motivations for a snitch are:

1. Want to be recognized as soon as possible.
2. Are traders/sellers themselves and want to get rid of any loose ends
3. Fear of loosing an account / standing in the torrent world.

That being said, I have never snitched on any one, I know that the people I have invited to some trackers have their accounts disabled, and to be honest I preferred not to ask why since these are places I call home.

I have never been in a site that handles rewards for snitching so I would conclude that fear is the main motivation.
 

othersna

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And add one more Maelstrom.
5. It's personal. X knows y and tries to give him a ''lesson''.

And this kind of snitching is one of the worst kinds. This snitch is not trying to help his trackers, but is trying to hurt someone else. This kind of snitch goes in the same category as the trader who snitches because his trade went bad. :)
 

CFour

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If you have information about a trader / seller I think you should report it to the staff to prevent such things but what I cacan't understand is when you buy an invite to join a certain tracker then you report the person who sold you the invite I think this is a stupid thing to do . For me telling a staff member about a person who cheats on ratio is also a good thing to do preventing such behaviors is the only way to secure the places we join and choose to spend our time on
 

Grape

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^How old are you in bt? the pattern i see is that usually the new ones try to impress. Yea, impress because if you are not a staff member, it's none of your business what X does. Back when a certain site was alive, i learned a bit or two about traders/sellers hunting - but hey, i was a staff member.
Put it this way: let's say your neighbour (he lives on the same floor, next door) smokes pot and the country you both live in has very harsh rules about it. What will you do, rat him out? isn't your ''job'' just to pay the rent/utilities/and only stuff like that? or you wanna be the old hag(i think every1 has one) that knows all the secrets from that bloc, hears all the gossipis/whispers(hell, might even compete with Varys;))?
 

othersna

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If you have information about a trader / seller I think you should report it to the staff to prevent such things but what I cacan't understand is when you buy an invite to join a certain tracker then you report the person who sold you the invite I think this is a stupid thing to do . For me telling a staff member about a person who cheats on ratio is also a good thing to do preventing such behaviors is the only way to secure the places we join and choose to spend our time on

As I have written many times, you have to ask yourself what motivates someone to be a "bad user hunter?" If someone PM's you and makes a trade offer, then by all means report the PM to your tracker staff and take a screenshot, as this is direct evidence. But trackers will question why a regular (non staff) member will go all gung ho to a trading forum, infiltrate it, and try to rat out the people there. The obvious suspicion by trackers is that you used to be a trader, got screwed by them, and is getting "revenge." Other members want to be "bad user hunter" to try to "impress" tracker staff and be a "kiss ass." I've said before, better spend your time downloading, uploading, seeding , and be active on forums/IRC. You will "impress" the tracker staff just as well doing that.

Now what happened to Grape just totally sucks. The person who ratted him out may be helping his tracker by snitching on him, but he motivation wasn't to help the tracker. The motivation was to hurt Grape. Therefore the "wrong" of stabbing Grape in the back does not justify the "good" of helping his tracker.
 

Hullos

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I'm on trackers that incentivize reporting by giving amnesty to the person who reported it. So if you don't know the person very well you invited you improperly then they will probably report you.
 

othersna

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I'm on trackers that incentivize reporting by giving amnesty to the person who reported it. So if you don't know the person very well you invited you improperly then they will probably report you.

I've seen these "amnesty" programs as well. I've seen one where if you are a n00b and bought an invite, they will give you amnesty if you rat out the person who sold the invite to you. I can understand a n00b turning in the seller because he didn't know buying an invite was wrong and is making amends for it. Plus the tracker gets rid of a seller. The n00b did not know the seller and was only involved in a "business deal" so I have no issue with the n00b turning in the seller.

In this thread I'm addressing ratting out a (former) friend or someone that you know. So perhaps participating in an "amnesty" program to save your own skin and rat out someone you know might not be the right thing. Might as well just stay banned rather than be a rat in this case.
 

oklahomaboy

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Yes, weeding out sellers is a good thing to do. Zero tolerance.

"Snitch" and "rat" have negative connotations, because they assume there should be a sense of loyalty towards the one being ratted out.
This holds true in some situations, a bank robber who does or doesn't rat out his buddy; mob guys snitching their cronies out; but in tracker world it works differently. Who owes loyalty or allegiance to an invite seller? It's a message on a screen for fuck's sake, not a buddy.
There is NO SNITCHING in torrent land.

It's a misnomer. It's just reporting culprits, turning in sons of bitches who wanna make a quick buck at the expense of the ignoramuses of tracker-land (yeah, that includes my dumb ass).

Therefore, if someone tells tracker staff about an invite seller, that's good. Do it. Never hesitate.
Why should there be loyalty? Fuck sellers.

I have come to this opinion by way of experience, being lied to and blocked / banned is no fun for a fledgling sticking his head round the corner for the first time in private tracker land. It happened to me, it was stupid and frustrating and time-consuming and I wish no one would have to endure that. If I was the owner of a site like this I would include large warnings of sites where not to go and a guide on how to report sellers.
 
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othersna

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Also food for thought - an invite seller is just looking out for # 1 (himself). He makes no qualms about screwing over trackers by selling invites and accounts to the highest bidder. So no one should be a "friend" or be "loyal" to an invite seller because he's got no loyalty to anyone but himself.
 
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oklahomaboy

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Also food for thought - an invite seller is just looking out for # 1 (himself). He makes no qualms about screwing over trackers by selling invites and accounts to the highest bidder. So no one should be a "friend" or be "loyal" to an invite seller because he's got no loyalty to anyone but himself.

Exactly, that's precisely why I made such a rant about it!
If people withhold from telling tracker staff about invite sellers because they don't wanna be considered 'snitches', something has gone wrong in the perception of the phenomenon; therefore I hope that people who do speak up won't be called snitches, not just because it's raping the English language with misnomers, but also because it might discourage others from reporting sellers.

I looked at the list of people banned because of selling/trading, and was frankly shocked how many there are!!!
Makes me even more furious. I'd like to do something to protect newbies; now I still remember my missteps, it hasn't faded yet, so if anyone has ideas regarding this, I'm happy to share my experiences in more detail in PM.
 

thedeh

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Is there ever a point to being a snitch... ever?

thedeh glares at Cthulhu Cthulhu .
 
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Snitches get stitches.
Trackers have rules, and personally, you should follow them.
Sellers should be dealt with though (even tho there will always be sellers, it's not a reason to let them giving invites to anyone for money).
I remember when I had an account at btracs (even had several at that time since I was banned more than once) and was scaring away the buyers by posting in some of the threads that I was X or Y tracker staff, explaining why buying invites was a bad idea, and that I was watching them closely and had the power to ban them forever from all private trackers. Also told them more than once that some of the threads were honeypots set up by some trackers staff to weed out the bad users.
Worked fine, had some fun, scared away quite a few buyers, got a few noobs to learn what to do instead of going to scum forums, then I stopped when I got bored of doing it, but it was not like snitching since I never reported any of it to any tracker staff, even et TPS. Even though I may have mentioned it in a thread now deleted. It was just educational crap.
 
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Dz

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Snitching, ratting,... if things happens in private, aren't they supposed to be private? If you trust someone to the level of making him a friend of yours, won't you simply give him another way to contact you or chat with you? Because I believe with friends, you can say private things, related to you real life, thus, you don't want others read about, aka, the internet. Which means, what I understood from othersna's post is that the person in question didn't know the person he invited very well, quick trust I would call it and honestly, I wouldn't consider this as a big deal, by making mistakes we learn better.

Back to the snitching thing, technically speaking, in private p2p and as staff on trackers, we try our best to keep the communities we staff as safe and secure as possible, it is a time eating process and makes us get angry many times due to the fact that we stand for a "free" (not as in free) world of sharing and caring. When you see people sell or trade things that are supposed to be free and friendly, you certainly get upset and many times, make you take decisions that might look harsh or bad, but at the end of the day, what we do is trying to keep our users safe and secure. My personal point of view about this snitching thing, we in CN, do snitch everywhere (I would call ourselves spies for the privacy, security and safety of our community) and due to the fact we staff can't be members everywhere, we rely on our users to report such things, sharing is caring and we do it for these reasons:

1- Our rules are clear about public/private giveaway(private means inside private sites where more than you and your friend can see the conversation), they are forbidden and the users agreed on these rules the first place, so they can't argue about that if we have proofs of these GA, this is why we have spies (othersna called them snitches ;) )
2- That reason 1 being said, we do not snitch(spy) inside forums like TPS, we have a very long standing relationship with staff here which is due to one reason, we have a mutual respect to each others(especially othersna who is a close friend of mine) and we are sure they will never allow a public invite giveaway to our site (CN) or any other site that doesn't allow that, it is very clear in TPS rules about no-movement-list which is number one about GA, the places we spy on are the one that invite giveway is allowed to all sites or places where trading is allowed.
3- Safety first, sharing is caring and caring is sharing, sometimes we don't have access to many sites, our community is there watching for us, but honestly they are aware of doing their part of job to keep their site(s) safe and I am sure many people here in TPS are doing the same thing.

All of that, snitching, spying, ratting,...it is a matter of what perception and side you are looking to it, for the "perpetrator" it is what the words means, for us, it is a part of our job keeping our members and communities safe.

To answer othersna question, for us, it does not matter where you meet your invitee(s), as long as they are clean and whiling to be active, they are welcome to CN, even if they came from the famous TI, we will welcome them. We all know that some people didn't have the right starting or were misguided, at certain levels, we certainly welcome them because some people are too naive.

TL;DR: Check my avatar ;)
 
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run930

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No point to snitching, at least like the example you gave in the original post. I mean, anyone who invites someone, no matter which way, is taking a risk because in 99% of the private trackers inviting a bad member gets you in trouble too. If you sell/trade you will probably get a bad member and you both will get banned. Otherwise, just more good people in the tracker which is good.
 

oklahomaboy

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The best is to prevent this even from happening, just be up front. I made mistakes in that department, two actually, and no matter how embarrassed/ashamed I was about coming clean, the people have understood/forgiven me. Snitching, naaah. Though there is a case to make for site owners who are obligated to tell other site owners about sellers/traders/buyers I guess.
 
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